Leffen at odds with Smash Ultimate despite DreamHack Winter win | ESPN ESPORTS

50 Comments

1. People played… and… oh god… enjoyed competitive brawl. I think ultimate will do just fine.

2. I’m currently at the state where leffen was at a few months ago. I was having a 1v1 with my buddy last night and he outplayed me in the first half of our matches (even with my main) and I ended up making a comeback beating him by a 4 stock score but I still felt unhappy with the victory. This game can be mentally draining if you let it be.

3. Ultimate Camping you say Leffen. Hungrybox wants to talk about Melee.

4. Yeah I love watching both smash games but ultimately I’ll prefer to watch melee more it sticks to its roots with mainly a Nintendo roster and I’m tired of seeing these new dlc characters take the crown in ultimate as the best character I don’t like seeing bayo and joker topping the Nintendo characters not only that but dominating them and they’re not a technically advanced characters they’re given power up to win shame on Nintendo for doing that to there own game

5. Melee is so good that it spoiled Leffen

6. I love humongous Leff but he be too negative sometimes.

7. Now Armada is the one that likes the latest Smash game

8. Maybe mr wiz can stop being a child and put melee back in evo. Melee almost 20 years old and still growing, no game does that except for like Tetris

9. Sad state of Smash :/

10. Good riddance!

11. Brawl sucked and people still played it competitively, however I genuinely enjoy the game and it will still be played competitively. Also melee jiggs is the best character in the game, and she camps harder than any character

12. It rewards camping
    Melee Jigglypuff: Allow me to introduce myself

13. Leffen is just mad because he vastly prefers the playstyle of Melee despite being good at Ultimate (A valid opinion! Everyone has preferences!) but gets most of his views and money nowadays by playing Ultimate and he's become increasingly resentful of that. So his only outlet is trying to convince others the game is trash so others will still watch him play something else he'll actually enjoy. If it's a playstyle he doesn't prefer it's now "jank."

    Quite a few complain about Ultimate not being fun to watch, but I just don't get it. Yes, it's bait-and-punish focused, but there's plenty of rushdown, combos, mixups, option coverage, all while being surrounded by an enormous matchup spread of incredibly balanced characters with wide range of tools and playstyles. It's normally thrilling to watch competitively, that's why it gets the views it does. Just because you don't like it doesn't make it bad.

14. To be honest the camping thing is player based mentality and has no way inpacted the game. Those players are obviously not good enough to win off any situation so they play defense. It happens in any fighting game.

15. In 2020, in 2020, twenty twenty, 2020 2020

16. Unfortunately I see Game and Watch being the future of competitive Ultimate.

17. What a drama queen.

18. he keeps threatening on quitting, but he just can't, deep inside he knows this is the game, his rage is just frustration from not having the melee mechanics, he would get better if he embraced the change and adapt to new mechanics

19. I think Leffen unfortunately has a point. Camping as a strategy is far too optimal. In a traditional 2D fighter, camping usually means you take chip damage and lose movement based benefits (guilty gear and UNIST have these). Smash has neither of these negatives for camping but all of the defensive benefits.

20. This was an excellent and informed video. Very much unlike majority of ESPN's bullshit

21. To sum it up.

    "I hate it because it's not melee."

    Come on, you all seen this coming.

22. Smash ultimate does not have high prize pools compared to other fighting games

23. He makes good points. He’s also a baby. The game and community doesn’t need him at all, but I will miss watching him play, he is talented. If it’s not worth it to you, then don’t play. But, unlike zero who just retired and moved on, he whines and complains constantly. Just sick of hearing it from him

24. We are talking about Leffen…he always complains about Ultimate

25. Diff between melee and ultimate is that when the new smash bros game drops, ultimate will pretty much die shortly after (competitive scene in particular) all while melee still being played with a dedicated fanbase and ultimate fans will move on to the new smash. So when the next smash does drops, pray it will at least be half as good as melee or it will suffer the same fate as brawl, sm4sh, and eventually ultimate.

26. I'm sorry but I just feel like Leffen complains about something all the time, if you really don't like the game that much no one is making you play it. I understand that Ultimate isn't as complex as Melee, but it wasn't designed to be. I personally appreciate Ultimate being a little easier to get into, because I don't have the time to spend practicing just movement alone for hours on end. I feel like Ultimate has helped me actually understand the mindset that goes into competitive Smash as now when I go back and play the older games, I do much better. But I get why people don't like it as much, but for me it's a good balance of still hard to master, but it doesn't feel impossible. I also like how much variety there is in control schemes, stages and character choices. I can't stand tap jump being on in Melee. But Melee is actually super glitchy due to its 13 month development cycle. Like whole techniques have to be banned like wobbling and only a few characters are actually viable. Plus there's some serious jank in Melee too, like Mewtwo being able to make his opponent fall through the ledge on Battlefield with confusion, attacks going through the bottom of Pokemon Stadium during transformations etc. So although Melee has more depth, it has more technical issues, Ultimate is basically what competitive Smash is if everything worked properly. Meaning it doesn't have as much depth. So I see the positives and negatives of both, but I'll stick to Ultimate

27. Watching hungry box gush over buffed puff has been a new season in ultimate for me. Also, hoping Armada wins a tournament with inkling.

28. OK ESPN I might actually subscribe to this ,that actually a good conversation starter, like every other sport even in traditional sports in 2020 will obviously see newer talent and obviously more patches and the meta will change hopefully for the better

29. Ima just go play Tekken 7. That game's hype.

30. I like the non biased reports. Not just bashing Leffen. Actually going into facts. Subscribed

31. This is rare. Good content on YouTube from a big Corp.

32. I still love smash ultimate either way competitive or not

33. games been pure dogshit from day 1
    like leffen said it appeals to casuals and people who dont care to pour 1000s of hours into it
    low skill cap low skill floor
    dogshitttttt

34. Melee 😀

35. I quit ult for one reason JANK (can't know 80 mu)

36. I love the game. But the amount of camping is crazy. In elite smash, if I choose to stand still, all I see is my opponent dash dashing and refusing to approach. So annoying. I force every engagement.

37. what do you mean? what are the top ult players gonna do? switch to melee? switch to more traditional Fighting games? highly doubt that from like 90% of the top players.

38. You can get camped in melee and in any other fighting game. The problem for him is that it is not Melee.
    Mkleo, tweek and gluttonny are giving incredible displays of skill and technique, I am enjoying the game more than ever.

39. I might have different reasons, but I too stopped going to locals long ago and now I just play FFA Battle Arena or Online Tourneys, for me it’s much more enjoyable than going to the locals and it’s free,

40. great video

41. Lol.

    Hilarious this was on tv

42. Meh, Leffen is a big time complainer anyway.

43. "It rewards camping"
    Melee jigglypuff:
    ?

44. Ultimate will DIE
    Melee FOREVER

45. This just sounds like a competitor who is complaining that he can't adapt to annoying gameplay.

46. Leffen would complain about things being bs even if he played a real life sport like football

47. Brawl was a better game

48. Please end Melee

49. This is why we need Salem.

50. Nintendo never gonna support Ultimate openly since not even the devs themselves endorse it, and the game is nice, but of course Leffen can't bother to play it for real since he was 1 entire Generation too too late for it. Where he once needed to learn 8/9 match ups, now he needs to learn 70 or more match ups…

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